Abhainn Dearg

[Douglas]

In the end the price has to be justified by the quality of the whisky, or the venture will fail. Selling whisky at high prices may be possible, but if the stuff in the bottle is not of excellent quality, even the most benevolent customers will not return.

Overall yes, but I don't think that applies to this first release which is all about the first legal release of whisky from a Lewis distillery. Maybe it's a local thing but I think it's thrilling to see a whisky coming from the Outer Hebrides.

Abhainn Dearg's first release of new spirit was pricy, partly because it was the historic first release. Marko's current new spirit price is a bit more affordable. I expect (or hope!) we'll see the same trend for his whisky.

It will be interesting to see what age Marko plans for his 'regular' releases. That will be the time to judge the success or otherwise of his whisky.

[Pudge72]

In the end the price has to be justified by the quality of the whisky, or the venture will fail. Selling whisky at high prices may be possible, but if the stuff in the bottle is not of excellent quality, even the most benevolent customers will not return.

Overall yes, but I don't think that applies to this first release which is all about the first legal release of whisky from a Lewis distillery. Maybe it's a local thing but I think it's thrilling to see a whisky coming from the Outer Hebrides.

Would someone be willing to provide further details of the significance (past history?) of a legal distillery opening in Lewis? This whisk(e)y newbie (soon to be a whisky or ultimately a whisky ) is very curious about distilling history in general, and would appreciate the additional insight.

A potentially similar situation in North America exists with Koval Distillery in Chicago, which advertises itself (and, in particular, its' Lion's Pride line of single grain whiskies) as the first legal distillery in the City of Chicago since the time of Prohibition.

Basically back in 1920-1933, when Prohibition took full effect in the US, several gangs, including one led by a 'gentleman' by the name of Al Capone, controlled the spirits trade in much of the city. For the early part of Prohibition, some distilleries had been allowed to continue operating for the production/distribution of whiskey to doctor's offices for patient use for medicinal purposes. In Chicago, the legally operating distilleries were eventually taken over by one of the major gangs (often with the help, or at least the tacit approval, of the Chicago police force). There has been no legally operating distillery within the City of Chicago since that time. Hence, the significance of the presence of the Koval Distillery.

[Peat Sampras]

There was a distillery in Lewis some 170years ago called the Shoeburn distillery

I cite:

The Shoeburn Distillery was the last legal distillery on the Isle of Lewis, built by Mr Stewart Mackenzie.  The distillery cost £14,000 to build and production started around 1830, it was hoped to replace the many illicit stills that were situated all over the islands, and in doing so improve the health and morals of the islanders, so believed Mr Mackenzie! 
 
The distillery was in full production around 1833 and records state that the spirit was in ‘great demand’, although it also mentions that little of the whisky left the island, the majority of the whisky going to the town of Stornoway where ‘considerable quantities of spirit’ were purchased.

In 1835 a Mr A. Robertson requested if he could act as a London agent for the distillery and stated he had London and Indian connections and that he could sell 1,000 to 2000 gallons of whisky. The outcome of this wasn’t known and at the time it wad reported that Mackenzie was experiencing financial problems. 

The Shoeburn distillery appears to have closed down in or around 1840 the exact reason isn’t known. However in 1844 the island was sold to Sir James Matheson, a complete abstainer and prohibitionist, who promptly demolished the buildings and replaced them with Lews Castle.
 
One character associated with the distillery was the last distiller in charge, a Mr Thomas Macnee, who was renowned for his generous measures. He became so well known that his name lives on in Gaelic ‘Tomhas mhÓr Mhic Mith’ he offered the many people who came to the distillery a good measure for cash including foreign sailors.

However distilling didn't stop, let's just say it went back to its roots.

Prior to the Shoeburn distillery two other producers of illegal whisky were well known and had the support of the local populace, these were located in Coll and Gress. These two illicit stills had the reputation of producing quality whisky .

from http://www.whiskymerchants.co.uk/#/abha ... 4534906946

cheers

[Pudge72]

Thanks for the info and the link, Peat! Very interesting heritage there on the Isle of Lewis.

[robjohnston]

In the end the price has to be justified by the quality of the whisky, or the venture will fail. Selling whisky at high prices may be possible, but if the stuff in the bottle is not of excellent quality, even the most benevolent customers will not return.

Overall yes, but I don't think that applies to this first release which is all about the first legal release of whisky from a Lewis distillery. Maybe it's a local thing but I think it's thrilling to see a whisky coming from the Outer Hebrides.

Abhainn Dearg's first release of new spirit was pricy, partly because it was the historic first release. Marko's current new spirit price is a bit more affordable. I expect (or hope!) we'll see the same trend for his whisky.

It will be interesting to see what age Marko plans for his 'regular' releases. That will be the time to judge the success or otherwise of his whisky.

next one is 5 yo then i think that one will be an annual release untill it hits 10/12 i think....

[an donas]

In the end the price has to be justified by the quality of the whisky, or the venture will fail. Selling whisky at high prices may be possible, but if the stuff in the bottle is not of excellent quality, even the most benevolent customers will not return.

Overall yes, but I don't think that applies to this first release which is all about the first legal release of whisky from a Lewis distillery. Maybe it's a local thing but I think it's thrilling to see a whisky coming from the Outer Hebrides.

Would someone be willing to provide further details of the significance (past history?) of a legal distillery opening in Lewis? This whisk(e)y newbie (soon to be a whisky or ultimately a whisky ) is very curious about distilling history in general, and would appreciate the additional insight.

A potentially similar situation in North America exists with Koval Distillery in Chicago, which advertises itself (and, in particular, its' Lion's Pride line of single grain whiskies) as the first legal distillery in the City of Chicago since the time of Prohibition.

Basically back in 1920-1933, when Prohibition took full effect in the US, several gangs, including one led by a 'gentleman' by the name of Al Capone, controlled the spirits trade in much of the city. For the early part of Prohibition, some distilleries had been allowed to continue operating for the production/distribution of whiskey to doctor's offices for patient use for medicinal purposes. In Chicago, the legally operating distilleries were eventually taken over by one of the major gangs (often with the help, or at least the tacit approval, of the Chicago police force). There has been no legally operating distillery within the City of Chicago since that time. Hence, the significance of the presence of the Koval Distillery.

Illicit distilling went on until WWI and possibly after. Was on a walk with Comann Eachdraidh Charlabhaigh on the West Side some years ago and a couple of local bodachs pointed out one or two coves which were known locally for producing the uisge beatha.

[Exciseman]

Have just read through this thread.

What comes through from the various posts is that a lot of regulars on this site would love the opportunity to get a bottle of this first Lewis whisky to actually DRINK. But the price point means that many won't be able to celebrate this wee piece of history. That strikes me as a shame.

Staying on the theme of price, £150 (plus P&P) for a 50cl bottle of 3 year old is equivalent to £210 for a 70cl bottle. Time will tell if a 2,011 bottle release from a fairly unknown distillery will sell through at this amount.

My guess is that all 2,011 will go. In the short-term, this will be good for the distillery's finances. But with regard to the 'long game', I'm not sure that alienating regular potential drinkers from the off makes great business sense.

[Mr Tattie Heid]

What comes through from the various posts is that a lot of regulars on this site would love the opportunity to get a bottle of this first Lewis whisky to actually DRINK. But the price point means that many won't be able to celebrate this wee piece of history. That strikes me as a shame.

Actually the very small number of bottles means that very few would ever be able to experience it, anyway. If they were sold at we think of as a drinking price, they would be snapped up and resold on eBay for market value, and even those among us who were lucky enough to get one would be thinking twice when they saw the potential profit.

Making this a very small release and keeping back plenty of stock to be bottled at a more mature age seems a reasonably prudent plan to me. Patience. If they hadn't released this at all, you'd still be in the same place.

[solera]

What comes through from the various posts is that a lot of regulars on this site would love the opportunity to get a bottle of this first Lewis whisky to actually DRINK. But the price point means that many won't be able to celebrate this wee piece of history. That strikes me as a shame.

Actually the very small number of bottles means that very few would ever be able to experience it, anyway. If they were sold at we think of as a drinking price, they would be snapped up and resold on eBay for market value, and even those among us who were lucky enough to get one would be thinking twice when they saw the potential profit.

Making this a very small release and keeping back plenty of stock to be bottled at a more mature age seems a reasonably prudent plan to me. Patience. If they hadn't released this at all, you'd still be in the same place.

Wise words Mr TH, wise words.

[13th]

Interesting debate.

I certainly don't begrudge Abhainn Dearg from cashing in on their first release and I wish them the best of luck with the business.

I might still get one but i reckon they will be available for a while because of the name + special feature + quality + price related to quantity isn't good enough to spark a buying frenzy

A suggestion I would make to Abhainn Dearg, to keep the keen drinkers on board, would be to release a good single cask 3yo to follow this up.

In order to avoid collector/investment/speculation and make a product intended for drinking it should be a small bottle (less than 500ml) but bigger than a mini. you could get probabbly get over 1100 odd 200ml bottles from a standard 250litre hogshead. I have the GlenGlassaugh 200ml new make and 1 yo ex bourbon and like the size for sampling (and very yummy).

Or they could go the miniature route. Most mini collectors think of anything under 100ml as a mini. 100ml is a good size for a proper sample.

They could also cash in on this by releasing a very small number of big bottles, from the same cask, at a silly price. 30 bottles for the collectors/investors/speculators to fight over (keep a few back for future auctions ) and hundreds of sample bottles for the enthusiasts who want to check up on progress.

[13th]

There are only 2011 bottles in total with no other special edition 3 year old bottles to be sold!

If you've just read my thread. Apologies for wasting your time. But if you did read it you probabbly had time to waste.

[Lawrence]

There are only 2011 bottles in total with no other special edition 3 year old bottles to be sold!

If you've just read my thread. Apologies for wasting your time. But if you did read it you probabbly had time to waste.

I read your post but didn't feel it was time wasted.

If I was a distiller I would want all the collector/investment/speculation I could get.....

[DavidUK]

Anyone know if these are selling or not? So far not one is listed on whiskybase

[C57]

Well they were being pre-sold. Are they actually released to anyone yet, so that they could put them on Whiskybase?

[DavidUK]

Well they were being pre-sold. Are they actually released to anyone yet, so that they could put them on Whiskybase?

Oh yes, of course. I'd forgotten about that.

[robjohnston]

Mid october so month and a bit yet, im sure you could email the distillery for details.

[an donas]

BBC Alba did a piece on AD at the National Mod this week. Didn't mention the price though!

A chance to practise your Gaelic!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/scotland/alba/naidheachdan/story/2011/10/111013_abhainndearg.shtml

[Exciseman]

I see that a single malt miniature has appeared on the scene.

[an donas]

I see that a single malt miniature has appeared on the scene.

How much? £20 a mini.

Have to say that I wouldn't buy it, even at £4. Tried a dram of AD at my local recently and it was disgusting. The only dram that I've ever struggled to finish. Shame, as I was hoping AD would be a good one.

[MacDeffe]

I agree with an donas

I tried the AD at Glasgow Whisky Festival, and I didn't like it all. Far too young. Shame

Steffen

[Exciseman]

About £4 or £5 from Just Miniatures and others (but not seemingly from the distillery).

[robjohnston]

The spirit of lewis is a lot better than the 3yo because its matured in smaller cask and they are sherry, the 3yo was bourbon and if im not mistaken ex bourbon
I think first fill bourbon would have been better.
It was really nice though to see how the spirit differed.
Although i was disappointed.

[RegularChumpington]

I tried a miniature through The Whisky Barrel. I'm not sure if my sample was corked or not - there was an intensely woody note. It wasn't what I'd note as a typical "over-oaked" note. It was more like chewing on a popsicle stick.

The 3yo is out of balance and it's no Kilchoman. But it hints at elements I've tasted in Glenfiddich, Glencraig, Banff, etc... I'm interested to see where it goes as it matures. The only note that I wasn't fully expecting (beyond the popsicle stick/unbleached napkin/etc note) was some brine.

I'll be watching it with interest but I'm certainly not buying a bottle until it is a little older.

[Drew]

Hi all,

I’ve just been on the Abainn Dearg web site and notice that the 3 yo is still up for sale, over two months after its release. I have to say that I’m a little surprised at this. Yes, I know that it’s a bit pricey and some of you that have tried it think that it could benefit from a few more years in the cask but this is a little piece of history produced by one of the most passionate whisky-heads in the industry.

For everyone who has gone up to the distillery in person will know that Mark has a real passion for what he is doing, I know I was sold when I went up last year. I went up with my father who, quite frankly hates whisky, but loves Scotland, so I drag him around Scotland with me on distillery tours, it’s a win win situation as he sees the Scotland that he hasn’t seen before I get see all the distilleries I haven’t seen before. We turned up to the distillery a day late, due to weather, but Mark took the time to give us a full tour of the distillery and the full history of the whisky of Lewis, not to mention a couple of stories about the local bobbies. When we had finished the tour and as I was having a taste, my Dad said to Mark “I can see you love what you do and that you don’t really care about the money”. To which Mark just smiled and nodded. It was the only distillery tour that my Dad has enjoyed and the best and most informative tour I have ever had. (and I’ve been on a few)

I’m saying this, not because I what it to sound like an appeal for Abhainn Dearg or Mark. But after three years of possibly not making a lot from the distillery I believe that Mark has priced the first malt release at a fair and honest price to try and see a little return from his investment in the industry. And for me, I want a man like Mark with his passion for whisky to stay in the business and to keep on learning and improving. I also think it’s OK for whisky lovers like us to try and support “whisky pioneers” like Mark if we can. When I was on the website I saw that they were selling minis of the three year old for £6.50, so all I’d say try it and if you like it – well who knows. I for one would like this little distillery to be a success and I’m looking forward to drinking some great, matured whiskies.

Slàinte mhòr agad!

[Jimmy321]

Fair comment, it is pricey for what it is IMO but if it sells out at this price even if it takes a year then it will be worth it, either it priced to sell out quickly and make a fast buck and a bit of hype in the process or it's priced to bring in the maximum amount of capital which perhaps is the best option.