new international shipping regulations?!

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new international shipping regulations?!

Postby mongo » 04 Jan 2013, 03:35

the mayan apocalypse is real, people. via a post on the malt maniacs facebook page i came to this announcement from royal mile whiskies re-posted on whisky intelligence:

http://www.whiskyintelligence.com/2013/ ... isky-news/

Unfortunately the way we ship alcohol to North America will change as of next week.
The Civil Aviation Authority is stopping the transport of high alcohol products in non-freight aeroplanes, as they are now classing these liquids as ‘dangerous goods’.

We are currently evaluating alternative solutions, but this is a complex issue and will take some time. As such Royal Mile Whiskies are to suspend shipping to North America as of the 8th January 2013 until further notice.

Obviously, we have enjoyed and greatly appreciated your custom in the past and we hope to be able to serve you again in the future. We know this is as disappointing for you as it is for us and we will do what we can to find a legal and cost effective method of shipping as quickly as we can. We should also point out that it is not just Royal Mile Whiskies that will be affected by these new regulations and all companies shipping alcohol over 24% alcohol using non-freight shippers will also be subject to the same regulations.

If you want to stock up before these new regulations take effect, there should be time for one last order at current costs before our courier stops collecting from us on 8th January. We would need to receive the order by 12 noon (GMT) on Monday 7th January. Please note that we will not be able to order ‘Out of Stock’ products from our suppliers in time to complete web orders before the deadline, so suggest that you order products that show ‘Good Availability’. If there is an item out of stock we will get in touch very quickly to let you know.


i have not heard anything from/about other retailers in the u.k. and have no idea if this applies to the e.u. as well. does anyone know more? do i need to take out a loan to get a year's worth of purchases in before the new regulations kick in next week?
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby Mr Tattie Heid » 04 Jan 2013, 03:46

I received this notice from RMW, and wondered about other retailers, too. Just now checked LFW, and they say nothing. Possibly it's a problem peculiar to the way RMW have been doing things. If not, I expect we'll hear about trouble from other retailers, too.

Perhaps Iain M has some knowledge of the situation?
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby cato » 04 Jan 2013, 03:53

Yikes that's bad news. I suspect a TWE announcement is imminent.
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby mongo » 04 Jan 2013, 04:04

Mr Tattie Heid wrote:I received this notice from RMW, and wondered about other retailers, too. Just now checked LFW, and they say nothing.


that means nothing, as rmw's own shipping page says nothing as well.

perhaps rmw are interpreting/taking the guidelines more seriously and/or implementing changes quicker. if this is across the board i'm surprised other stores have not sent out similar notifications. also, it is unclear as to whether this is a "u.k.-->u.s." thing or a "anywhere-->u.s." thing.
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby Mr Tattie Heid » 04 Jan 2013, 04:55

They cite the Civil Aviation Authority--presumably that's the CAA of the UK. But they specifically refer to shipments to North America. I'm guessing it's a UK airline reg that only affects North American sales, as pretty much all the rest of their foreign sales are by surface transport to Europe. I expect they'll work something out--perhaps it's just a matter of weighing whether it's better to charge more to put it on a FedEx plane, or take six weeks to get to you via container ship.

Kind of funny that the odd bottle of whisky is considered dangerous cargo on an airplane loaded with a zillion gallons of jet fuel.
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby Malt-Teaser » 04 Jan 2013, 09:33

Thanks to my job I have to be re-certified for dangerous goods every two years by the German equivalent of the CAA.
My last renewal was just a couple or so weeks ago in December and we were informed of a few changes to some of those diamond-shaped stickers and signs which declare dangerous goods, but nothing on any changes relevant to alcohol.

I have now replied to that MM fb comment, but I'll do so here as well:
It is illegal and has been for many years, to transport any alcohol over 70% abv on a passenger aircraft whether as cargo, in luggage or as carry-on even from Duty Free shops. In fact as a side note it is illegal to receive, buy or have any alcohol over 70% abv in Germany at all as an individual.

Almost all postage within the EU (between countries) is sent air mail and not by land, how else do you think parcels arrive within 2-4 days?

At the moment I really don't know what RMW are alluding to and would like to see some actual reference or online CAA statement to this effect. I've looked and can't find any. We can all speculate as to whether it's based upon some USA regulation about shipping alcohol, CAA whim or other. I really would like Iain to clarify this with hard facts.
Also, I don't believe a CAA whim as the CAA can't make up their own rules for just one country, these dangerous goods regulations are the same world-wide and policed / enforced by the local relevant authorities.


Edit:
I hasten to add that should this really be the case (which I don't believe to be so) then all spitis can immediately be removed from all travel retail and duty free shops worldwide, as of right now. No dangerous goods can be carried on to an aircraft, with the exception of things like one cigarette lighter per person .... etc .... so if spirits are suddenly dangerous goods, they need special cartons approved for dangerous goods, special (diamond) stickers on the cartons and special handling via cargo handlers as opposed to normal postal systems.
Once again, if this were the case then I'd surely have been informed in December of a new upcoming category of dangerous goods, with associated DG numbers and symbols for alcohol.
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby whisky_collector » 04 Jan 2013, 11:50

I received an email from Scotch Whisky Auctions last week along the same lines that they cannot currently ship to the USA for the same reason.
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby Tim F » 04 Jan 2013, 12:56

Don't panic.
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby C57 » 04 Jan 2013, 13:22

You're very cryptic today Tim ;)
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby Tim F » 04 Jan 2013, 16:46

Can't say much Nick. We are monitoring the situation with cautious optimism at present.
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby mongo » 04 Jan 2013, 16:52

tim: should the optimism turn out to have been misplaced (as i hope it will not) will there be sufficient lead time to get an order in under the old regulations? (the royal mail website seems to say this new regulation kicks in on january 14.)
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby cowfish » 04 Jan 2013, 17:18

mongo wrote:tim: should the optimism turn out to have been misplaced (as i hope it will not) will there be sufficient lead time to get an order in under the old regulations? (the royal mail website seems to say this new regulation kicks in on january 14.)


It normally on takes us a couple of working days to get an order into the post (unless you're ordering things that go out of stock or which takes us a while to find in the warehouse) so if you order this weekend then you should be fine for the Royal Mail deadline. However, if we are affected by the changes then we won't be able to send a parcel out and will let you know.
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby cato » 04 Jan 2013, 18:29

Tim: I'm with mongo, I'd like a couple days notice if possible so I can get one last order placed in time to ship. Clearly the U.S. government is in the process of completing its plan to implement soviet style controls over the citizenry. A nice box of whisky from TWE will tide me over.
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby mongo » 04 Jan 2013, 19:00

cato: i've already got my order in today. or, to be more accurate, i almost have: i have to call to complete it (for some reason my one credit card that doesn't charge foreign exchange conversion fees always fails to go through on the twe site).
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby Tim F » 04 Jan 2013, 19:09

cato: If you want to be 100% safe I'd get it done this weekend as per Cowfish's post above.
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby mongo » 04 Jan 2013, 20:03

hope to finalize the order early on monday. everyone must have been gone by the time i called.
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby Jazz Lover » 04 Jan 2013, 22:46

Please allow me to quote Mongo. ''What a shocker! distributors and retailer across the land will gnash
their teeth and rend their garments when they find out.'' :lol:
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby mongo » 05 Jan 2013, 02:38

the good news, at least for now, is that this seems to be restricted to shipments from the u.k.
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby jsaliga » 06 Jan 2013, 23:27

It isn't good news for me mongo. Last year I ordered more whisky from TWE than any other source. This really sucks.

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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby Troubadix » 07 Jan 2013, 15:02

Malt-Teaser wrote:In fact as a side note it is illegal to receive, buy or have any alcohol over 70% abv in Germany at all as an individual.


Are you shure about that? How come I can buy "Stroh Rum" (80% abv) in the supermarket and "Trinkalkohol" (90-95% abv) at the pharmacy?
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby mongo » 07 Jan 2013, 15:35

mongo wrote:hope to finalize the order early on monday. everyone must have been gone by the time i called.


and order completed. hopefully not the last, and hopefully not the last for a long time.

tried to snag a bottle of the yamazaki sherry cask but it was already gone.
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby cato » 07 Jan 2013, 17:44

I submitted my order yesterday. A few gems I just can't get in the US.
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby Malt-Teaser » 08 Jan 2013, 16:55

Troubadix wrote:
Malt-Teaser wrote:In fact as a side note it is illegal to receive, buy or have any alcohol over 70% abv in Germany at all as an individual.


Are you shure about that? How come I can buy "Stroh Rum" (80% abv) in the supermarket and "Trinkalkohol" (90-95% abv) at the pharmacy?


Hmmm, the only stroh rum I've seen in supermarkets here is very cheap and not so strong, 80° maybe, not 80% abv.
Having said this I do know a whisky shop in Munich which has previously sold Poteen at just over 80% abv and I was surprised to see an online dealer offering GT Stagg at 72.x% recently.

I know for a fact it is illegal to carry any spirit over 70% on aircraft and I got my "not allowed in Germany at all" fact from the customs people last time I was negotiating receipt of some MMA bottles at their office.
One of the bottles was just over 60% and the customs officer passed comment about it being very strong to which I replied it was still less than the 70% not allowed on aircraft.

His reply to me quite surprised me when he stated that not only wasn't 70+% not allowed on aircraft, but it wasn't allowed in Germany and if this had been more than 70% he would have had to confiscate and destroy it.


As for pure alcohol in chemists, that is regulated but allowed under some kind of different law as it's not (intended) for drinking, although I have heard unofficially that there are certain outdoor types who have been known to try it in winter, along with paraffin and various other 'oils' ............... :-o
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby Mr Tattie Heid » 08 Jan 2013, 17:52

Occasionally (or perhaps more than occasionally) even official types like customs agents are misinformed. Perhaps what that one fellow told you was correct, but I wouldn't necessarily take it as gospel without any other corroboration.
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Re: new international shipping regulations?!

Postby Malt-Teaser » 08 Jan 2013, 18:16

There's also the possibility of what the car world would call "Grey Imports" (or to you MR. TH "Gray Imports" :D

What the eye doesn't see ...... and all that.
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