SMWS - becoming a rip off ?

[Willie JJ]

Now, it's an increasingly commercialised profit-centre for Glenmorangie.

I'd have to agree with that. It's no longer a 'club' in the way that term is normally understood. But, ultimately it is a product that you can choose to buy, or not. There are some very interesting bottles that come out of the society and that makes it worthwhile for me.

[newbie]

I would like to be a member and have access to some of the fantastic bottlings they have. Like others have said it would be poor value to pay a membership fee to only buy a handful of bottles per year. If they ever decide to introduce a cheaper membership rate I would be happy to join. If they don't I am simply not bothered as there is plenty of other whisky I can spend my money on!

[C57]

I would like to be a member and have access to some of the fantastic bottlings they have. Like others have said it would be poor value to pay a membership fee to only buy a handful of bottles per year. If they ever decide to introduce a cheaper membership rate I would be happy to join. If they don't I am simply not bothered as there is plenty of other whisky I can spend my money on!

You can always get me to order them for you.

[Exciseman]

As far as I'm aware, a member can ask for an order to be shipped to any UK address - I've had them delivered to work occasionally. So, I guess that a group of mates who just wanted bottlings could have a single membership between them.

[Nick Brown]

Shared membership is cheating.

[C57]

Shared membership is cheating.

An occasional bottle is OK I think - they allow you to have it shipped to someone else with a compliments card so they obviously don't mind the odd one

[ras mazunga]

Shared membership is cheating.

...

[Ann-Helen]

I just want to say , me and my husband are members.
We live in Norway when ever we`re in scotland we go to the vault .
When it comes to ordering bottles it`s a bit tricky because they can`t ship to Norway but for us there`s a solution ;since I`m swedish We`re often there and sweden has its own branch so you can order smws bottles there
I don`t mind paying for being apart of this society, I suppose that some of the money paid inn goes to buying casks.So if there are alots of people not paying but buying through other members the outcome will be that less casks will be bought and we will get less to choose from

[Nick Brown]

Ann-Helen: i'm surprised there isn't a brnch of SMWS in Norway. There are number of whisky enthusiasts in Norway, both on these forums and at festivals such as Spirit of Speyside. Maybe there are licensing issues that make it difficult to set up a Norwegian branch.

[Ann-Helen]

Well Nick I don`t know why and it could be because Norway has a system that says only the vinmonopol(state owned liquerstore) can sell alcohol that`s over 4,5% . Sweden have similar system but not as ridgid.
So when you order a bottle from SMWS you pick it upp at systembolaget(the swedish variety of vinmonopolet)

[bamber]

I think the prices of bottles are a borderline rip off now and I am in two minds whether to renew. I probably wont, though in all honesty it's because I only visit the bar twice a year these days and that's the thing I really enjoy about the SMWS. The selection was the worst it's ever been last time I was at the London bar too.

Had some great night there in the past though

[C57]

Pricewise, remember that online retailers generally charge around £7.50 for postage, whereas SMWS is free. So that's £7.50 off a bottle straightaway (though obviously some retailers reduce postage per bottle if you're ordering several)

[Gilles Deleuze]

I'm wondering if there are differences in the price ranges between the US and UK chapters of the Society. Going by the current exchange rates, the prices of bottlings in the US chapter begin at around 57 GBP ($85) and reach upwards of 170 GBP ($250).
I'm quite curious about how this price range compares with the cost of bottlings from the UK chapter...

[newbie]

Deleted

[Nick Brown]

I'm wondering if there are differences in the price ranges between the US and UK chapters of the Society. Going by the current exchange rates, the prices of bottlings in the US chapter begin at around 57 GBP ($85) and reach upwards of 170 GBP ($250).
I'm quite curious about how this price range compares with the cost of bottlings from the UK chapter...

From memory, the UK prices start at around GBP38 and seldom exceed about GBP100 - although we have started to see more that do break the 100 pound barrier. I think we might even be seeing regular old bottles starting to come in at GBP115.

But at the same time, the prices of IBs has also risen sharply.

[Gilles Deleuze]

I'm wondering if there are differences in the price ranges between the US and UK chapters of the Society. Going by the current exchange rates, the prices of bottlings in the US chapter begin at around 57 GBP ($85) and reach upwards of 170 GBP ($250).
I'm quite curious about how this price range compares with the cost of bottlings from the UK chapter...

From memory, the UK prices start at around GBP38 and seldom exceed about GBP100 - although we have started to see more that do break the 100 pound barrier. I think we might even be seeing regular old bottles starting to come in at GBP115.

But at the same time, the prices of IBs has also risen sharply.

Thanks, Nick! I joined the Society a couple months ago, and I've been very happy with the quality of the three bottles I've purchased so far. However, knowing what I now do about the UK Society prices, I'd be lying if I said I thought 60 GBP was cheap for, say, an 11 year old whisky. While I think the quality is great, I do wish the price ceiling for the younger bottlings was a little lower.

[C57]

Remember that in the UK that's like paying £52 and then adding postage the usual online shops would charge.
Obviously if you're lucky enough to have a good retailer that you can reac with zero travel cost, that becomes irrelevant....

[Nick Brown]

Remember that in the UK that's like paying £52 and then adding postage the usual online shops would charge.
Obviously if you're lucky enough to have a good retailer that you can reac with zero travel cost, that becomes irrelevant....

And 11yo society bottlings don't cost £52 in the UK.

[Mr Tattie Heid]

It's like anything else in our free-market world...prices are set (theoretically) at a point where enough people are willing to pay for however much they have to sell. There are about seven billion people on the planet for whom it's not worth it, and if you're one of them, well, you have lots of company.

I joined this past year, in large part so I could go to the Vaults, since Ron (a member for a couple of years) wouldn't be joining me this year. (Ironically, I never made it there, but that's okay--they'll still be there next year.) I expect to buy three to six bottles in the current membership year. Yes, it's a bit pricey, and I'll have to decide from year to year whether it's worth it. I suppose I'm subsidizing people who use the facilities a lot, but that doesn't bother me at all. Somebody somewhere is subsidizing me for something else I'm not even aware of, I'm sure. People who say "I only want to pay for what I use" would probably be very surprised at how much some things they take for granted would cost that way.

I can't believe that the SMWS is any great profit magnet for LVMH. A drop of Kininvie in the barrel, more likely.

[ash005]

i just renewed my membership last year

i joined in dec 2007 as a present to myself

for my £100 joining fee i got.....

a bottle of whisky (worth about £70)

two tickets to a tasting - in the end i didn't go due to a newly pregnant wife

12 months worth of newsletters etc.


i was in edinburgh on the 30 dec last year and was considering calling in, but due to trains and a small child it didn't happen

i have spent about £100 or so on three other bottles since and renewed my membership for £45

so in two years ive spent approx £245 for 4 bottle of cs whisky, a tasting i missed and some damn good information and reading material

in my opinion its reasonable value for money - i paid more last year for my octane subscription and a weekend at silverstone!

as is my opinion about most stuff, if you don't like it - don't drink/smoke/eat/join or watch it


ash .

[Malt-Teaser]

I used to love being a member of the SMWS whilst I was still in England, but when i moved to Germany they passed me over to some EU SMWS clowns who just couldn't organise the proverbial over-indulgence in either a brewery or distillery. So I unfortunately had to cancel my membership.

[Malt-Teaser]

I used to love being a member of the SMWS whilst I was still in England, but when i moved to Germany they passed me over to some EU SMWS clowns who just couldn't organise the proverbial over-indulgence in either a brewery or distillery. So I unfortunately had to cancel my membership.

If I were allowed t ojoin the UK SMWS again from here in Germany, then I probably would. But my experience of the EU version was one of infrequent and very late magazines. Old (expired) bottling lists and all at a premium cost which was more than I had ever paid in the UK.

[thewhiskyguy]

Now it could be said I'm bias, but this is my own opinion as a member! I'm not sure why you guys are questioning the membership?

The bottles aren't really that expensive, for example the new 25.46:

Refill barrel,
17 years old,
Distilled 1991
56.1%ABV
Outturn: 228 botles

It's on the new list is amazing (because of the panel it's guaranteed pretty good quality) and only £66 (with postage) or £64 in the venues as there is £2 off the list price when you use a venue.
Now I live in Edinburgh, so can go to the venue and sample it first and see if I agree with the tasting notes then buy, now Royal Mile Whisky has Similar 1990 Old Malt Cask:

http://www.royalmilewhiskies.com/product.asp?pf_id=0010000032673
ABV: 50 %
Volume: 0.7 Litre
Age: 18 Years Old
Price: £64.95

or

http://www.royalmilewhiskies.com/produc ... 0000029659
Maturation: Sherry
Vintage: 1990's
Bottler: Gordon & MacPhail
Volume:0.7
Alc. Volume: 61.1
Price: £63.95

Both of these I would be unlikely to sample first and would be a pot luck of whether it was really worth it! Plus there is a £7.70 delivery charge. so would be more expensive. Also, where if you are looking for a special treat, say an old Glenfarclas at the whisky exchange at £175 you can get a 1982 bottling or for £1500 you can get the 40 year old, but 1.141 is 41 year old or the 40 year old 7.48 both at £185 and you can try it before you buy if near a venue. Even the current 24.104 at £60 (£58 at a venue) is cheaper than the distillery bottling from the whisky exchange http://www.thewhiskyexchange.com/P-8762.aspx.

You can still buy proprietor bottlings if you want and compare, 52.18 7 years old and is £39 (£37 from the venues) and really interesting compare against the standard 12 years old bottle £22 approx, but where else do you get to see single cask whisky at it's most natural and in most cases very unique from the standard expressions.

Feel this thread started out as a dig at not being Independent any more, but the good out ways the bad. Access to a bigger cask range without having to commit to pretty much buying the whisky and buying power to fill our own casks. Staff get a better deal too.

No ones really said what the membership is either:

£100 to join with an annual £49.50 renewal fee. Joint membership is £125 for 2 people (which me and my wife have) and the renewal is around £65. The society send out a pack now with 4 10cl mixed bottles, hardback members book and note book, badge and personal card, glossy magazine, list of whiskies and events guide.

Now I know the fee doesn't in anyway pays for the Venues, which are managed very well Exciseman.If you visit a venue Doug and all the Guys at the Vaults are great, Jan and the team in Queen Street are extremely knowledgeable and helpful, plus Jen, David, Jonathan and TJ at London are great fun to chat to.
The Membership fee as far as I'm aware pays the admin, printing of the monthly list and unfiltered mag and membership pack costs as the venues have to be self sustaining. If anyones believes the list comes out for nothing your crazy, has any one tried printing business cards or even photos? It's not cheap and at the end of the day you as a member want to know what whiskies are being bottled so the cost has to be put in some where down the line. I wouldn't want to pay for 18000+ magazines and a 36 page guide monthly.

Now lets be honest if you love whisky and want to try new and different expressions from a diverse range of distilleries you join, however, if you don't and just have excuses to make it seem expensive then don't complain or join.

[Exciseman]

I didn't even get a hard-copy list for the offering's that went on sale on Friday. Just an e-mail. So, given that the venues are seemingly self-financing, I'm paying circa £4 a month to receive a link to an online catalogue. Seems great value. I wonder if other Internet sellers should start doing the same? I've sure that their customers wouldn't mind.

[thewhiskyguy]

Exciseman, If you aren't receiving hard copied call or email the membership line or even a Venue and ask to be added to the mailing list they send you a copy out.

By being on the e-mailing list you get your list faster. Depending on how people sign up for the emails a lot of people opt out of receiving mail without realising because they haven't read the fine print. See this a tastings all the time. One benefit of being on the email list is that you get special offers other members don't, they translate the difference over.
Also there is still the cost in someone producing and email out to everyone.

Think my point is that it's not that expensive for bottles of this nature and in some cases cheaper.
I personally haven't had many bottlings comparable to the quality I get from the society and I'm happy to pay for that and consistency if it's only £4.13 (works out less as we have joint membership). I know that I rarely ever get that level of consistency from other bottlers. That's not to say other people in the industry don't do a great job, but SMWS is a benchmark that people are copying.

The title of this post shouldn't be "becoming a rip off", but "SMWS - in a changing economic climate does it seem expensive?" or "SMWS - why should I renew?' nothing has really changed since it started in 1982 (before that it was just friends buying casks), membership prices and bottle costs will always increase due to inflation the VAT changes.
So what if it isn't independent any more that if anything helps to make it able to be more competitively priced.

Guess, it's more than £49.50 a year to place orders, ignoring costing and history. Being a member is about being part of something different, something which causes discussion and new experiences. Xmas taking the bottle of 76 I had around the doors back in Newcastle and enjoying it simply because it's great, think those moments are worth the cost for me. It's not about being affluent, personally I'm far from it, but everyone I know who is a member is passionate about the whisky and sharing it with others.